I’m at a retreat today on the Privilege and Challenge of Aging. Last night we talked about our internal ageism. When we look in the mirror critically we are adopting a societal attitude that we should look young. Even when we know that is impossible. When do we get to relax that judgment?
Christine, precisely! It seems the answer of “when” we get to relax judgment is up to us. It requires a “re-think” and a mind shift on our part—not easy. Also I love the title of your retreat!
This was so good, Debbie. I'm still in my 60s, and in my daily fitness and health practices, I have an eye on how those practices will affect my mobility and general health decades from now. A college PE professor defined fitness as the ability to go through one's day and doing everyday tasks (carrying groceries, working in the garden, washing the car, etc.) with ease and without injury. I like that. The wrinkles around my mouth are the most prominent - sunscreen is my best friend from now on. I enjoyed reading what these women shared with you. Thank you.
Mary, I’ve learned from my physician husband that the inability to accomplish every day tasks (like the ones you list) is a significant marker of age-related decline. So yes, I’m with you on this kind of fitness.
I am 82, as you know, so quite a lot older, but I don't disagree with much said here. Just thought that was interesting in itself. I also have an expanding abdomen, which I would prefer not to be there, but the rest is OK. I am completely grey-haired, never wear make-up and wouldn't dream of surgery. I have the good fortune to look young, especially my skin (always did – major problem up to my mid-40s as no one would take me seriously (this age business is a two-way street, never forget that!), but none of this is highly important to me. Perhaps it helps that my dear husband is constantly saying "You look prettier every day".
I'm 68, mostly healthy, but I carry a bit too much weight. I don't like that but shifting it is very hard indeed. I use Weight Watchers online but am always foiled by chocolate or something sweet. This summer I had to go up a size in clothes and I hated that, but I don't really worry about it, or I would lose it! I wear a little makeup if I'm leaving the house - soft eyeliner and mascara and a 'quiet' lipstick. I've always had bad eyebags and I would love to have had them fixed but I could never afford it and it's too late now. They've been around for so long I don't really notice them anymore. I am quite vain still, but I think it's helpful to be interested in how you look - up to a point. Indoors I'm a big slob - in pull-on bras and elastic-waisted harem pants and my long grey hair twisted in a knot!
I often find that bags under one's eyes look really cool. Benicio Del Toro has always had them, as well as Alison Janney. I have deep hollows under mine.
At this age I am through with caring about corporations template of what beauty is. I have limited amounts of energy and do not want to waste it on vanity. Health and physical strength is my priority and focusing on the richness of life, reading, music, nature, art, etc, there is so much more to feed my spirit then trying to look younger then I am. Who are we trying to impress now. I have seen many women, who in trying to look younger only emphasize their age. I intend to enjoy this age by being kind to myself and accepting myself at being the age I am. We do not know how much time we have left at this age, it seems a waste to use it worrying about trying to look younger. To me this is a time we can finally release all of these expectations and really enjoy life, it is up to us.
I'm 73 and I still care about how I look, but in a different way then when I was younger.
I want to look like who I feel like: a lifelong tomboy/cowgirl who has matured into a dignified matriarch.
I don't color my thin hair. I wish it was a beautiful silver white, but it's a dull dishwater gray. I own a lot of hats and scarves to compensate. Lipstick is my only makeup.
I wear jeans like I always have, but take advantage of high waisted stretch jeans to hide the tummy flab. And bell bottoms are back!
At this stage of life I try to accept what I can't change - the wrinkles - and focus on what I can: weight, strength and endurance.
I'm picky about what I eat (Mediterranean diet), do a lot of walking, wear sunscreen, practise daily yoga and lift weights. And I still ride my horse.
It is so mixed for me. Definitely using skincare which started when I was bored during the pandemic. What bothered me was less how I looked, but my face skin didn't feel like itself when my hand brushed against it. I never did skin care beyond washing my face. I can say that slowly starting tretinoin made my skin feel the way it used to when I touched it. This may just be me because my sense of touch is what I rely on most, such as with cooking and baking and buying clothes, much more than the visual.
Once I started tretinoin which I know was unusual to begin with rather than OTC retinols, but starting skin care in late 2020 at 68, I thought I would start with the most scientifically proven treatment. (FYI, despite being a doctor and able to write a derm prescription for myself. I started with online Curology, because they allowed for the lowest doses, and then online Dermatica when I reached higher doses. When I reached a prescription level dose, I tried generic prescription tretinoin, but not being covered by my insurance it was as expensive and the formulation was less pleasant to use than the online versions.). Miraculously, after a year, my skin felt like it used to feel when I touched it washing my face. I will keep using this indefinitely. That started me on YouTube, where I found a lovely young cosmetic dermatologist with a great attitude who turned out to be in NYC. I recommend her YouTube videos (Google Dr Shereene Idriss. ) She started a minimalist skin care line recently but her videos show all the simple, more inexpensive things you can do for your skin.) She trained at the best derm residency in NYC. Her skin care products are now in Sephora. Definitely more money than I usually spent on skin care, but efficient, with very few products.) I was encouraged in all this by my 40 something cousin who has a great skin care routine and was living with us for the early part of the pandemic.)
Ironically I had being highlighting my once blonde hair since menopause when my husband became bothered that my once blonde hair was beginning to turn brown. My mother, who had dark black Roumanian hair (I take after my father's blue eyed blonde family), only had a few white hairs at her 80 birthday, although she is fully white now at 95. During the pandemic highlights every 2 months were out. Now despite my husband's protests, I am embracing my brown hair. I may feel differently when it's white!
It was Zoom sessions that drove me to use make up. In my 30's a nice saleswoman taught me to put on makeup Sunday mornings when the store was empty. She was amused that I had missed this stage in adolescence. I still only used it for special dressy occasions. But zoom was different. I was seeing my face all day everyday in the most unflattering light--literally. A different young friend who worked on zoom prepandemic gave me the gift of a makeup consultation just focused on zoom, which left me with a basic, simple plan not to look like night of the living dead on zoom. I still rarely wear make up in real life. I didn't pack any for the reunion.
What I can say is that after a life of being an overweight not physically active person (except during ski season-- the only sport I love and which I did prepare for), the thought of possibly following my female ancestors and living to age 100, galvanized me in my early 60s to lose weight and build muscle, so I wouldn't be a frail 95 yo. I started working out. Since the beginning of the pandemic I started walking to avoid contagion in taxis, buses and subways. I am still walking. Traffic in NYC is so bad that I can walk somewhere in the time a cab would take. My goal is 5+ miles a day. Even on a bad day I usually manage 3. I am getting faster each week.
Still not using makeup except special occasions, but find the skin care regimen pleasant and relaxing. I have grown to love walking. Even though the pandemic is winding down, few patients want to give up zoom. I have an office available a few afternoons and evenings, but am only using it on Tuesdays for now. But being at home let's me cook while working and timing things so I can check on something in the oven between patients. This has also helped me gradually lose weight with home cooked meals.
Thanks to anyone who read this far. Thank you Debbie for discussing things I didn't usually talk about with anyone and providing this space.
Love the idea that we like and take care of the way we present to the world all the way through our lives. I don't see this as negative, or vain or anyhing. Much more like healthy self-respect. Others usually see you as you see yourself. So keep paying attention. My mom did until her death at 97. And boy, she looked lovely even then.
Aviva, I like the way you reframe “vanity.” My mom, who died a year ago at almost 93, had the same approach and always looked well put together. I suppose that influences us!
Think our generation are role models to redefine ‘old’ for future generations - so as we age healthier and more engaged we are drawing a nee road map of what age looks like. And it looks better and better! Keep taking care…
My midsection "extra" is all in the front, in a belly that has looked between 3 and 5 months pregnant at all times, depending on my weight. I despair of getting rid of it.
Kudos to you Debbie, for collecting the perspectives and stitching it all together in such a readable article. I'm 75 and it was refreshing to read so much of my own inner life on the page. I have been widowed for eight years. With the pandemic and the stresses of or national political life, I feel like aged 15 years during the same time span. I feel some inspiration from the sharing of your group of women and the comments.
Leslie, the aging 15 years because of the pandemic… yes, I can relate to that. My local yoga class stopped permanently, for ex. Glad you found this helpful.
Deb Benfield of Aging Body Awareness does a great job writing about this. I recommend her newsletter. Body acceptance is so important at every age and especially after 70. We are being targeted as a potential market by the pharma companies making the new weight loss drugs, which put us at greater risk for osteoporosis and sarcopenia.
It costs nothing to eat less, which is why there is no product to market for intermittent fasting. I haven't eaten breakfast in years, it's a myth that it's necessary.
PS Another recommendation: "The Obesity Paradox," a book by Dr. Carl Lavie. He reviews the data on why and how the weight we gain after midlife protects our health.
I do what I can to look younger. I’m going to start a short vodcast with a friend who is a skin care expert. She tries products so you don’t have to and I’m all about ingredients.
I had to quit alcohol. Too many side effects. I feel so much better for it. My body complains when it doesn’t like something.
I will soon hit 67 running, tripping, forgetting, no make up, yoga, who cares? I care less and less but think about all of these things without the prior obsessions of an earlier age. I love our hard won wrinkles. I had a tint put in my hair only once this year. I regret I did so as my hair has been drier ever since. I won't be doing that again. Thank you for this fun article and all of the interviews. Relaxing with a cup of cacao.
Thank you for the question. I will have to come back to this. I do feel that getting older makes us wiser and we care less about the small unimportant stuff, we also recognize how valuable our time is. I think this is part of it. More later, my new friend.
I loved this! Such a help to me. I’m 70 and went gray after I lost my hair to chemo so it was an easy grow out. I’m thrilled to be ok after treatment for ovarian cancer stage three in 2020. I’m grateful to be alive and still somewhat vain about my looks and weight. And I’m relieved to know the tummy we get might be universal with age
Ruth, I had to look up SAGA cruises; what a wonderful idea! I'm increasingly fascinated with women in their 80s and 90s: I want to hear their stories and, of course, what they might have to say to me.
My goodness! I am 76, and feel inordinately weird even writing that as my own age. I am vain and act on it daily. I lift weights 30 minutes each day. I have had face stuff and will have more. I work hard on staying healthy. My biggest deficit? I have no friends at this point in my life. Guys, yes--women friends, no. SOS?
![[B]OLD AGE with Debbie Weil](https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/e_trim:10:white/e_trim:10:transparent/h_72,c_limit,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fb939748d-5d80-4d0f-867c-2ed252ac633c_1344x256.png)
I’m at a retreat today on the Privilege and Challenge of Aging. Last night we talked about our internal ageism. When we look in the mirror critically we are adopting a societal attitude that we should look young. Even when we know that is impossible. When do we get to relax that judgment?
Christine, precisely! It seems the answer of “when” we get to relax judgment is up to us. It requires a “re-think” and a mind shift on our part—not easy. Also I love the title of your retreat!
I guess we get to relax about it when we decide to.
This was so good, Debbie. I'm still in my 60s, and in my daily fitness and health practices, I have an eye on how those practices will affect my mobility and general health decades from now. A college PE professor defined fitness as the ability to go through one's day and doing everyday tasks (carrying groceries, working in the garden, washing the car, etc.) with ease and without injury. I like that. The wrinkles around my mouth are the most prominent - sunscreen is my best friend from now on. I enjoyed reading what these women shared with you. Thank you.
Mary, I’ve learned from my physician husband that the inability to accomplish every day tasks (like the ones you list) is a significant marker of age-related decline. So yes, I’m with you on this kind of fitness.
I am 82, as you know, so quite a lot older, but I don't disagree with much said here. Just thought that was interesting in itself. I also have an expanding abdomen, which I would prefer not to be there, but the rest is OK. I am completely grey-haired, never wear make-up and wouldn't dream of surgery. I have the good fortune to look young, especially my skin (always did – major problem up to my mid-40s as no one would take me seriously (this age business is a two-way street, never forget that!), but none of this is highly important to me. Perhaps it helps that my dear husband is constantly saying "You look prettier every day".
Ann, I love that we can admit to our little “vanities.” I’m generally happy with my skin too. Just luck.
I can’t speak about you but everyone is surprised when I say my age. BUT I really mean it about years ago. I struggled to be taken seriously.
Loving husband is the best beauty product going!
Nothing like a sweet husband. Best beauty product in the world!
YESsssss! Couldn’t agree more.
I'm 68, mostly healthy, but I carry a bit too much weight. I don't like that but shifting it is very hard indeed. I use Weight Watchers online but am always foiled by chocolate or something sweet. This summer I had to go up a size in clothes and I hated that, but I don't really worry about it, or I would lose it! I wear a little makeup if I'm leaving the house - soft eyeliner and mascara and a 'quiet' lipstick. I've always had bad eyebags and I would love to have had them fixed but I could never afford it and it's too late now. They've been around for so long I don't really notice them anymore. I am quite vain still, but I think it's helpful to be interested in how you look - up to a point. Indoors I'm a big slob - in pull-on bras and elastic-waisted harem pants and my long grey hair twisted in a knot!
June, 💗 your honesty. Yes, I had to go up a size too in the pants I like from kuhl.com - haven’t mentioned that to anyone, til now.
I often find that bags under one's eyes look really cool. Benicio Del Toro has always had them, as well as Alison Janney. I have deep hollows under mine.
You just made my day.
At this age I am through with caring about corporations template of what beauty is. I have limited amounts of energy and do not want to waste it on vanity. Health and physical strength is my priority and focusing on the richness of life, reading, music, nature, art, etc, there is so much more to feed my spirit then trying to look younger then I am. Who are we trying to impress now. I have seen many women, who in trying to look younger only emphasize their age. I intend to enjoy this age by being kind to myself and accepting myself at being the age I am. We do not know how much time we have left at this age, it seems a waste to use it worrying about trying to look younger. To me this is a time we can finally release all of these expectations and really enjoy life, it is up to us.
Sharon, I agree! Thanks for spelling out this form of gratitude for life and for where we are, NOW.
I'm 73 and I still care about how I look, but in a different way then when I was younger.
I want to look like who I feel like: a lifelong tomboy/cowgirl who has matured into a dignified matriarch.
I don't color my thin hair. I wish it was a beautiful silver white, but it's a dull dishwater gray. I own a lot of hats and scarves to compensate. Lipstick is my only makeup.
I wear jeans like I always have, but take advantage of high waisted stretch jeans to hide the tummy flab. And bell bottoms are back!
At this stage of life I try to accept what I can't change - the wrinkles - and focus on what I can: weight, strength and endurance.
I'm picky about what I eat (Mediterranean diet), do a lot of walking, wear sunscreen, practise daily yoga and lift weights. And I still ride my horse.
Logan, love this: “a lifelong tomboy/cowgirl who has matured into a dignified matriarch.”
It is so mixed for me. Definitely using skincare which started when I was bored during the pandemic. What bothered me was less how I looked, but my face skin didn't feel like itself when my hand brushed against it. I never did skin care beyond washing my face. I can say that slowly starting tretinoin made my skin feel the way it used to when I touched it. This may just be me because my sense of touch is what I rely on most, such as with cooking and baking and buying clothes, much more than the visual.
Once I started tretinoin which I know was unusual to begin with rather than OTC retinols, but starting skin care in late 2020 at 68, I thought I would start with the most scientifically proven treatment. (FYI, despite being a doctor and able to write a derm prescription for myself. I started with online Curology, because they allowed for the lowest doses, and then online Dermatica when I reached higher doses. When I reached a prescription level dose, I tried generic prescription tretinoin, but not being covered by my insurance it was as expensive and the formulation was less pleasant to use than the online versions.). Miraculously, after a year, my skin felt like it used to feel when I touched it washing my face. I will keep using this indefinitely. That started me on YouTube, where I found a lovely young cosmetic dermatologist with a great attitude who turned out to be in NYC. I recommend her YouTube videos (Google Dr Shereene Idriss. ) She started a minimalist skin care line recently but her videos show all the simple, more inexpensive things you can do for your skin.) She trained at the best derm residency in NYC. Her skin care products are now in Sephora. Definitely more money than I usually spent on skin care, but efficient, with very few products.) I was encouraged in all this by my 40 something cousin who has a great skin care routine and was living with us for the early part of the pandemic.)
Ironically I had being highlighting my once blonde hair since menopause when my husband became bothered that my once blonde hair was beginning to turn brown. My mother, who had dark black Roumanian hair (I take after my father's blue eyed blonde family), only had a few white hairs at her 80 birthday, although she is fully white now at 95. During the pandemic highlights every 2 months were out. Now despite my husband's protests, I am embracing my brown hair. I may feel differently when it's white!
It was Zoom sessions that drove me to use make up. In my 30's a nice saleswoman taught me to put on makeup Sunday mornings when the store was empty. She was amused that I had missed this stage in adolescence. I still only used it for special dressy occasions. But zoom was different. I was seeing my face all day everyday in the most unflattering light--literally. A different young friend who worked on zoom prepandemic gave me the gift of a makeup consultation just focused on zoom, which left me with a basic, simple plan not to look like night of the living dead on zoom. I still rarely wear make up in real life. I didn't pack any for the reunion.
What I can say is that after a life of being an overweight not physically active person (except during ski season-- the only sport I love and which I did prepare for), the thought of possibly following my female ancestors and living to age 100, galvanized me in my early 60s to lose weight and build muscle, so I wouldn't be a frail 95 yo. I started working out. Since the beginning of the pandemic I started walking to avoid contagion in taxis, buses and subways. I am still walking. Traffic in NYC is so bad that I can walk somewhere in the time a cab would take. My goal is 5+ miles a day. Even on a bad day I usually manage 3. I am getting faster each week.
Still not using makeup except special occasions, but find the skin care regimen pleasant and relaxing. I have grown to love walking. Even though the pandemic is winding down, few patients want to give up zoom. I have an office available a few afternoons and evenings, but am only using it on Tuesdays for now. But being at home let's me cook while working and timing things so I can check on something in the oven between patients. This has also helped me gradually lose weight with home cooked meals.
Thanks to anyone who read this far. Thank you Debbie for discussing things I didn't usually talk about with anyone and providing this space.
Sandy Cohen (almost 72)
Sandy, wow a lot of info and things to follow up on. Thanks for all the details!
Love the idea that we like and take care of the way we present to the world all the way through our lives. I don't see this as negative, or vain or anyhing. Much more like healthy self-respect. Others usually see you as you see yourself. So keep paying attention. My mom did until her death at 97. And boy, she looked lovely even then.
Aviva, I like the way you reframe “vanity.” My mom, who died a year ago at almost 93, had the same approach and always looked well put together. I suppose that influences us!
Think our generation are role models to redefine ‘old’ for future generations - so as we age healthier and more engaged we are drawing a nee road map of what age looks like. And it looks better and better! Keep taking care…
Logan, with you… “trying to accept what I can’t change”!
My midsection "extra" is all in the front, in a belly that has looked between 3 and 5 months pregnant at all times, depending on my weight. I despair of getting rid of it.
Lee, I know your “despair,” but I’m absolutely sure you look wonderful nonetheless!
same here.
Kudos to you Debbie, for collecting the perspectives and stitching it all together in such a readable article. I'm 75 and it was refreshing to read so much of my own inner life on the page. I have been widowed for eight years. With the pandemic and the stresses of or national political life, I feel like aged 15 years during the same time span. I feel some inspiration from the sharing of your group of women and the comments.
Leslie, the aging 15 years because of the pandemic… yes, I can relate to that. My local yoga class stopped permanently, for ex. Glad you found this helpful.
Deb Benfield of Aging Body Awareness does a great job writing about this. I recommend her newsletter. Body acceptance is so important at every age and especially after 70. We are being targeted as a potential market by the pharma companies making the new weight loss drugs, which put us at greater risk for osteoporosis and sarcopenia.
It costs nothing to eat less, which is why there is no product to market for intermittent fasting. I haven't eaten breakfast in years, it's a myth that it's necessary.
I've done intermittent fasting since 2012.
PS Another recommendation: "The Obesity Paradox," a book by Dr. Carl Lavie. He reviews the data on why and how the weight we gain after midlife protects our health.
https://www.amazon.com/Obesity-Paradox-Thinner-Heavier-Healthier/dp/1469090953
thanks Stella!
Wonderful interviews.
I do what I can to look younger. I’m going to start a short vodcast with a friend who is a skin care expert. She tries products so you don’t have to and I’m all about ingredients.
I had to quit alcohol. Too many side effects. I feel so much better for it. My body complains when it doesn’t like something.
Carissa, I’m realizing the same thing with alcohol. I enjoy a good craft cocktail but the side effects, ugh.
It’s not worth it. Alcohol is just plain bad for us. It’s dehydrating, aging, weight gain promoting, depletes our vit C, etc.
I will soon hit 67 running, tripping, forgetting, no make up, yoga, who cares? I care less and less but think about all of these things without the prior obsessions of an earlier age. I love our hard won wrinkles. I had a tint put in my hair only once this year. I regret I did so as my hair has been drier ever since. I won't be doing that again. Thank you for this fun article and all of the interviews. Relaxing with a cup of cacao.
Prajna, tell us how you got rid of your prior obsessions??! I’d love to hear if you have a specific technique… or was it a gradual process?
Thank you for the question. I will have to come back to this. I do feel that getting older makes us wiser and we care less about the small unimportant stuff, we also recognize how valuable our time is. I think this is part of it. More later, my new friend.
I loved this! Such a help to me. I’m 70 and went gray after I lost my hair to chemo so it was an easy grow out. I’m thrilled to be ok after treatment for ovarian cancer stage three in 2020. I’m grateful to be alive and still somewhat vain about my looks and weight. And I’m relieved to know the tummy we get might be universal with age
Susan, such an honest both/and: “grateful to be alive and still somewhat vain about my looks and weight.”
Thanks for this Debbie.
I’m a Teen-Old at just 60. I’m writing this on a SAGA cruise with my mum, who is 80 this year.
It’s been a fascinating experience observing the spectrum of age - 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and maybe beyond.
Certainly not my normal idea of a holiday but lovely to spend time with my mum, feel young (!) and reflect on my own views on age and ageism.
Ruth, I had to look up SAGA cruises; what a wonderful idea! I'm increasingly fascinated with women in their 80s and 90s: I want to hear their stories and, of course, what they might have to say to me.
There are some fascinating stories here for sure Debbie. You should book on one, fertile research grounds ☀️
My goodness! I am 76, and feel inordinately weird even writing that as my own age. I am vain and act on it daily. I lift weights 30 minutes each day. I have had face stuff and will have more. I work hard on staying healthy. My biggest deficit? I have no friends at this point in my life. Guys, yes--women friends, no. SOS?