Interesting Debbie! But firstly, im very sorry to hear that you recently lost both parents. That’s tough!
I’m writing a piece right now about the healthspan v lifespan gap too— your 9 years closely aligns. That’s a bloody long time to live without capability and life quality! No thanks!
My angle is how exercise can flip the marginal decade to the bonus decade.
My “plan” is to go hard and strong til the end then suddenly fall off the perch (hopefully while whistling) like the old bird that I hopefully will be.
Crikey! I just used the Death Clock calculator, according to which:
You will live to be 103 years, 3 months and 28 days old!
(In the small print below, it says Avg life expectancy of other Female testers from Switzerland with your BMI: 93.5 years old, which is a bit less scary.)
I have had a lot of health issues in the last two decades and still schlep a few chronic conditions with me, though they are currently well managed. The last big horror was nearly losing the ability to walk or control much below the waist, solved with spinal stenosis surgery three years ago this summer. The gradual and frightening run-up to that and the subsequent long recovery gave me a glimpse of what it might be like to physically fade away.
Coming out on the other side of that both caused and enabled me to make a lot of changes in my life. Working with my GP, a nutritionist, endocrinologist, physiotherapist, and weight trainer, I changed the way I eat (in a nutshell: more protein, smaller meals, way less to almost no alcohol), worked on proprioception and balance, built up muscle, became more physically active again. These are all things that I now know are permanent changes in the way I live, not just some post-op recovery plan.
In a couple months I turn 60, spring chicken that I am, and feel like I have lived several lives already while simultaneously believing I have a fresh start now with another life or two still ahead. It's an odd feeling.
My mother died way too early, taken at 74 after quickly capitulating to pancreatic cancer. If I imagine that I may only have another 15 years, I feel like I am treading water right now and want to get on to my next (phase of) life pronto. If, as the Death Clock suggests, I have another almost 44 years: well, I am exhausted just thinking about that.
I'd like to hit 90 while still healthy. My mother-in-law turns 90 this autumn, and is leaving next week for a month in Mongolia. It is her eighth trip I think (her first visit was in her 70s) and she hangs out with her adopted nomad family in a yurt in the Altai. That is the energy I want.
Caroline, you’re making me realize that I am NOT paying enough attention to these things: “I changed the way I eat (in a nutshell: more protein, smaller meals, way less to almost no alcohol), worked on proprioception and balance, built up muscle, became more physically active again.”
I love your mother-in-law's stay in the Yurt in Mongolia! I stayed with a family too when I was horse trekking there with a friend. Those visits would be so perfect for an old person. The pace of life is perfect.
Hi Debbie, your post arrived just the week I have been thinking about lifespan and the conditions of living a long life. I am an 87 y o widow who cared for my husband with PD till he died 3 years ago. I am a horse owner and rider. I lost an old horse 2 months ago and my second horse has become mildly but chronically lame since February. My horses and other animals are my life but I feel I must NOT stop riding. I have been thinking on and off about buying a second horse young and healthy enough for me to ride another 5 years at least. Well, I did so this week. He is a 7 year old. For my 90th birthday ride (I do a special one with horsey friends every birthday) he will be 10 years old.
Now to your question about living to 100: Yes, I do want to and I want my 100th birthday ride (with my friends who are mostly at least 10 years younger than me) to be on this horse who will be 20.
All my exercise is around caring for my dog, cats, chickens and horses. For pleasure-exercise I ride a horse on the trails with my dog. Of course I could die next week, or month or ten years from now. If that happens the animals are all taken care of and the people who will take them already know and love them.
For me I decided that I will live well and for longer if I have really important (to me personally) interests and useful activities in my life. I think I have commented on your posts before that I find it hard to find models of sporty old people. But I really enjoy being a model sporty old person for my friends. The woman who sold me the horse this week broke down in tears as I left the stables because she had never seen an old person like me and I guess had underestimated the ones she had known.
By the way in case you are wondering, I do have artificial hips and knees but no other health problems. I know I am a very lucky old person. (For now...)
Sylvia, I absolutely love this comment — especially the part about your new horse! You are very inspiring, even if we can’t all keep up with you. Also love the way you are planning specific celebrations for your big birthdays coming up (90 and 100!). I suspect a forward-looking, very optimistic outlook on life is an important factor for longevity. Thanks for sharing.
Only if I’m mentally and physically able to care for my shed and still keep active. In my90’s would be fine. You know I believe that being
active and fit are the main components …always keep moving! Active aging includes sexually active too don’t forget. 😉☺️ I’ve had to work hard getting sugar, bread and drinking down to once a week, now every 2-3 weeks. Wine is too acidic for me, so there was whiskey and gin instead. Not anymore! I can tell it’s better for my face, middle and energy!
How do I find the Clock assessment? I’m not registering for a poll! Great food for thought dear Deb! You always inspire me to think and self assess. Thank you for this! 🥰🤗
So sorry for your loss! I know how it is; my 93-year-old father died last December after a long, painful decline, and my 90-year-old mom is dealing with early stages of dementia (brought on by taking too much valium for decades, apparently) and other issues. It's not pretty. I'm much more interested in living well than living long, and at age 63, I'm definitely eating better than I used to. Not that I ever ate a ton of junk food. Haven't had a drink since 2018 as part of cutting out sugar — but alcohol is much easier for me to cut out than actual sugar, as alcohol never agreed with me. I've been walking on my treadmill desk for an hour or two most days lately, but I need to do much more in the way of exercise, especially weight training. Not at all interested in living to 100, especially as most people I care about would likely be gone by then.
I started your survey, Debbie, but gave up because it didn't offer anything but the yes-no options. I am a very healthy 83, I eat well and exercise as you know and indulge in a very small amount of alcohol. I met a mother and toddler on the street just now and the toddler was squatting, as they do, and I asked the mother if she could squat like that and she said no, can you? I wasn't sure what would happen, but I managed it right in the middle of the pavement. I don't think "the granny who squats" has the same resonance as the head-standing variation!
I have a friend who is 100, who has all her marbles and is great to visit, but she does need help. I wouldn't mind being there if I were as fit as she is, but I certainly don't welcome the unhealthy years. And it is probably rather lonely unless one has a lot of younger friends (and, of course, my family).
Tx Ann! It’s a “yes” or “no” answer but the next box down says, “Tell us why” — maybe you’re suggesting you wanted a third option: “Maybe” or “It depends” - !
I know, but I didn't know which way to jump! I'm not a questionnaire sort of person, I always want to explain how complicated it all is - whatever the subject.
I tried two rounds of the Death Clock. Putting in my current information, I got to 83. Losing ten pounds and returning to my more optimistic self, I get to stick around to 95. Since I was already playing with morbidity, I entered my oldest sons information - he only has until 62. (A point I will bring to his attention, I assure you.) So, the clock answered your question.
I don't want to live until 100 because I would have to lose too many people along the way, including my children. It's too harsh a penalty to bear.
I'm very sorry to hear about your folks, Debbie. It's always a gut blow, regardless of their, or our, age. I have to offer a resounding "Nope!" on the question about living to the century mark. We're helping with grandparents who are in their late 80s and early 90s, and despite being incredibly active all of their lives (hiking in Glacier National Park with us and such), a series of incidents has severely affected their quality of life.
My mother is also in the early stages of dementia, and during her recent visit, we had a glimpse of what life is going to be like for her in the most-likely near future. It isn't pretty.
I haven't done the death clock, but on my father's side of my family, no one has made it to 70 years old for about four generations. The heart gets them. On my mother's side, they live forever, but can't remember the last 20 years. I'm hoping for somewhere in between, preferably with the ticker giving out on the trail while schlepping up some mountain. (I have to apologize in advance for those are going to have to haul my carcass out of there!)
Debbie, I couldn't help giving a rueful laugh just reading your title question--and a voice in my head immediately said "no!" I've spent a lot of time lately pondering this very question, and talking about it with my friends--who, like you and me, are mostly in their early- to mid-70s. And interestingly, most of us do not aspire to live to 100, for all the reasons you mention. Having watched the slow and often painful (at least emotionally) decline of parents and older friends, we shudder at the thought of losing our mobility, our freedom, our independence, our memories, and finally, our identities. In my own case, I've lived a very active life--at 72, I still run or walk about 40 miles a week, love to hike in challenging terrain, and generally relish being outdoors as much as I possibly can. It is one of the central joys of my retirement, and I've been fortunate to enjoy the good health that makes such activities possible. My parents' deaths were instructive: my dad had a long decline into inactivity and dementia, a gradual withdrawing from life that was painful to watch (especially for my mom) and for him, a lifelong outdoorsman, even more painful to experience. When he died at 89, we all felt a sense of relief that he was finally freed from his suffering. My mom, in contrast, lived for 7 very active years after his passing, was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer just shy of her 90th birthday, refused all but palliative treatment, and died 5 months later. Those were difficult months, to be sure, but she fulfilled her wish to die in her own home (she didn't spend a single day in the hospital) with her children nearby. I have thought often about her final weeks, which were, frankly, grueling. Had assisted suicide been available to her, I believe she would have chosen that path. Such a decision becomes much more complicated, of course, if one is suffering from Alzheimer's disease or another form of dementia. Would I choose it? It's hard to say, and would depend, of course, on my age and condition, and the wishes of my family. But I would very much want that option--as I believe most of us would, if we face the question honestly.
Katy, thank you for this thoughtful (and informative) comment. You probably know this; MAID (Medical Aid in Dying) is legal in the state of Maine, since 2020.
The issue for me is that I don’t think I will be able to afford to live to 100. When we were in WA state property taxes rose with home prices driving seniors out of their homes. There was subsidized housing but they were awful places to live. There was a senior group who showed up at Town Hall meetings asking for improvements. Seniors shouldn’t have to worry about not having heat in the winter.
My parents are 91 and 88 and thank G-d have means and healthy brain function. My dad’s wife is 86 and is still athletic and takes great care of my dad who has physical needs. (He blames it on being a marathon runner in his 40s.)
I’m so relieved my parents never ran into Alzheimer’s and can afford care if needed.
Very important piece, Deb. I appreciate and relate to your honesty. Aging is hard to write about because even though it’s something that begins at birth, we’ve come to associate aging with death. That’s why we don’t like to look at old people or befriend them. The thing is, there is so much variability in aging that it feels like a lottery, I guess because it is! One of my favorite expressions is, “you’ve seen one 80-year old. you’ve seen one 80-year-old! None of us know the condition will be in at 82 (I’m now 81!), 90, 100, or beyond. The best we can do is live until we die.
I just took the Death Clock test & it said I'd live to be 104. I don't believe that, given my various ailments. But it's an interesting app. I'd be surprised to live to 90, though it's a bit depressing to be thinking about it.
Yes it is hard to think about for me too. All anyone can do is to just keep on trucking, in my case playing music with my friends, writing, loving my wife of almost 60 years.
Hmm. The Death Clock told me I would live until 85. I asked for a cause of death, and it said suicide. Which is interesting and not what I expected...😲
Jeffrey, whoa, that’s a bit weird; Sam assures me that the app is really not reliable. Not enough factors considered, etc. etc. I asked ChatGPT (ha ha) how accurate the death clock is. It replied, it’s not, really, but it’s a motivational tool to prompt you to change your diet or exercise or sleep more, or whatever!
No worries, I'm aware this is a long way from being a scientifically accurate method. It doesn't factor in one's genetic inheritance, for example. And anyway, 85 sounds about right for me!
Very interesting Debbie. I'd suggest those living in paradise, e.g-Stonington,ME, will have distinct advantages. My wife and I dream of moving to midcoast ME, to be surrounded by stunningly beautiful nature and wonderfully warm, inviting neighbors. I think that helps and may give you and husband the leg up you need. I may end up nearer to Connecticut coast or the Bershires. Still in the planning stage. Overall I also share your concerns, and with whether to eliminate alcohol or not (tough one). Cheers!
![[B]OLD AGE with Debbie Weil](https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!i8Z0!,w_80,h_80,c_fill,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep,g_auto/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fdaaca764-d8d6-4a1b-bf58-61dbb72810fc_842x842.png)
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Interesting Debbie! But firstly, im very sorry to hear that you recently lost both parents. That’s tough!
I’m writing a piece right now about the healthspan v lifespan gap too— your 9 years closely aligns. That’s a bloody long time to live without capability and life quality! No thanks!
My angle is how exercise can flip the marginal decade to the bonus decade.
My “plan” is to go hard and strong til the end then suddenly fall off the perch (hopefully while whistling) like the old bird that I hopefully will be.
Crikey! I just used the Death Clock calculator, according to which:
You will live to be 103 years, 3 months and 28 days old!
(In the small print below, it says Avg life expectancy of other Female testers from Switzerland with your BMI: 93.5 years old, which is a bit less scary.)
I have had a lot of health issues in the last two decades and still schlep a few chronic conditions with me, though they are currently well managed. The last big horror was nearly losing the ability to walk or control much below the waist, solved with spinal stenosis surgery three years ago this summer. The gradual and frightening run-up to that and the subsequent long recovery gave me a glimpse of what it might be like to physically fade away.
Coming out on the other side of that both caused and enabled me to make a lot of changes in my life. Working with my GP, a nutritionist, endocrinologist, physiotherapist, and weight trainer, I changed the way I eat (in a nutshell: more protein, smaller meals, way less to almost no alcohol), worked on proprioception and balance, built up muscle, became more physically active again. These are all things that I now know are permanent changes in the way I live, not just some post-op recovery plan.
In a couple months I turn 60, spring chicken that I am, and feel like I have lived several lives already while simultaneously believing I have a fresh start now with another life or two still ahead. It's an odd feeling.
My mother died way too early, taken at 74 after quickly capitulating to pancreatic cancer. If I imagine that I may only have another 15 years, I feel like I am treading water right now and want to get on to my next (phase of) life pronto. If, as the Death Clock suggests, I have another almost 44 years: well, I am exhausted just thinking about that.
I'd like to hit 90 while still healthy. My mother-in-law turns 90 this autumn, and is leaving next week for a month in Mongolia. It is her eighth trip I think (her first visit was in her 70s) and she hangs out with her adopted nomad family in a yurt in the Altai. That is the energy I want.
Caroline, you’re making me realize that I am NOT paying enough attention to these things: “I changed the way I eat (in a nutshell: more protein, smaller meals, way less to almost no alcohol), worked on proprioception and balance, built up muscle, became more physically active again.”
Never too late to start, dear Debbie!
I love your mother-in-law's stay in the Yurt in Mongolia! I stayed with a family too when I was horse trekking there with a friend. Those visits would be so perfect for an old person. The pace of life is perfect.
Hi Debbie, your post arrived just the week I have been thinking about lifespan and the conditions of living a long life. I am an 87 y o widow who cared for my husband with PD till he died 3 years ago. I am a horse owner and rider. I lost an old horse 2 months ago and my second horse has become mildly but chronically lame since February. My horses and other animals are my life but I feel I must NOT stop riding. I have been thinking on and off about buying a second horse young and healthy enough for me to ride another 5 years at least. Well, I did so this week. He is a 7 year old. For my 90th birthday ride (I do a special one with horsey friends every birthday) he will be 10 years old.
Now to your question about living to 100: Yes, I do want to and I want my 100th birthday ride (with my friends who are mostly at least 10 years younger than me) to be on this horse who will be 20.
All my exercise is around caring for my dog, cats, chickens and horses. For pleasure-exercise I ride a horse on the trails with my dog. Of course I could die next week, or month or ten years from now. If that happens the animals are all taken care of and the people who will take them already know and love them.
For me I decided that I will live well and for longer if I have really important (to me personally) interests and useful activities in my life. I think I have commented on your posts before that I find it hard to find models of sporty old people. But I really enjoy being a model sporty old person for my friends. The woman who sold me the horse this week broke down in tears as I left the stables because she had never seen an old person like me and I guess had underestimated the ones she had known.
By the way in case you are wondering, I do have artificial hips and knees but no other health problems. I know I am a very lucky old person. (For now...)
(Apologies for long comment).
Sylvia, I absolutely love this comment — especially the part about your new horse! You are very inspiring, even if we can’t all keep up with you. Also love the way you are planning specific celebrations for your big birthdays coming up (90 and 100!). I suspect a forward-looking, very optimistic outlook on life is an important factor for longevity. Thanks for sharing.
Only if I’m mentally and physically able to care for my shed and still keep active. In my90’s would be fine. You know I believe that being
active and fit are the main components …always keep moving! Active aging includes sexually active too don’t forget. 😉☺️ I’ve had to work hard getting sugar, bread and drinking down to once a week, now every 2-3 weeks. Wine is too acidic for me, so there was whiskey and gin instead. Not anymore! I can tell it’s better for my face, middle and energy!
How do I find the Clock assessment? I’m not registering for a poll! Great food for thought dear Deb! You always inspire me to think and self assess. Thank you for this! 🥰🤗
So sorry for your loss! I know how it is; my 93-year-old father died last December after a long, painful decline, and my 90-year-old mom is dealing with early stages of dementia (brought on by taking too much valium for decades, apparently) and other issues. It's not pretty. I'm much more interested in living well than living long, and at age 63, I'm definitely eating better than I used to. Not that I ever ate a ton of junk food. Haven't had a drink since 2018 as part of cutting out sugar — but alcohol is much easier for me to cut out than actual sugar, as alcohol never agreed with me. I've been walking on my treadmill desk for an hour or two most days lately, but I need to do much more in the way of exercise, especially weight training. Not at all interested in living to 100, especially as most people I care about would likely be gone by then.
I started your survey, Debbie, but gave up because it didn't offer anything but the yes-no options. I am a very healthy 83, I eat well and exercise as you know and indulge in a very small amount of alcohol. I met a mother and toddler on the street just now and the toddler was squatting, as they do, and I asked the mother if she could squat like that and she said no, can you? I wasn't sure what would happen, but I managed it right in the middle of the pavement. I don't think "the granny who squats" has the same resonance as the head-standing variation!
I have a friend who is 100, who has all her marbles and is great to visit, but she does need help. I wouldn't mind being there if I were as fit as she is, but I certainly don't welcome the unhealthy years. And it is probably rather lonely unless one has a lot of younger friends (and, of course, my family).
Tx Ann! It’s a “yes” or “no” answer but the next box down says, “Tell us why” — maybe you’re suggesting you wanted a third option: “Maybe” or “It depends” - !
I know, but I didn't know which way to jump! I'm not a questionnaire sort of person, I always want to explain how complicated it all is - whatever the subject.
ha ha what I love about you Ann!
exactly so.
Oh. I love the granny who squats!
I tried two rounds of the Death Clock. Putting in my current information, I got to 83. Losing ten pounds and returning to my more optimistic self, I get to stick around to 95. Since I was already playing with morbidity, I entered my oldest sons information - he only has until 62. (A point I will bring to his attention, I assure you.) So, the clock answered your question.
I don't want to live until 100 because I would have to lose too many people along the way, including my children. It's too harsh a penalty to bear.
I'm very sorry to hear about your folks, Debbie. It's always a gut blow, regardless of their, or our, age. I have to offer a resounding "Nope!" on the question about living to the century mark. We're helping with grandparents who are in their late 80s and early 90s, and despite being incredibly active all of their lives (hiking in Glacier National Park with us and such), a series of incidents has severely affected their quality of life.
My mother is also in the early stages of dementia, and during her recent visit, we had a glimpse of what life is going to be like for her in the most-likely near future. It isn't pretty.
I haven't done the death clock, but on my father's side of my family, no one has made it to 70 years old for about four generations. The heart gets them. On my mother's side, they live forever, but can't remember the last 20 years. I'm hoping for somewhere in between, preferably with the ticker giving out on the trail while schlepping up some mountain. (I have to apologize in advance for those are going to have to haul my carcass out of there!)
Debbie, I couldn't help giving a rueful laugh just reading your title question--and a voice in my head immediately said "no!" I've spent a lot of time lately pondering this very question, and talking about it with my friends--who, like you and me, are mostly in their early- to mid-70s. And interestingly, most of us do not aspire to live to 100, for all the reasons you mention. Having watched the slow and often painful (at least emotionally) decline of parents and older friends, we shudder at the thought of losing our mobility, our freedom, our independence, our memories, and finally, our identities. In my own case, I've lived a very active life--at 72, I still run or walk about 40 miles a week, love to hike in challenging terrain, and generally relish being outdoors as much as I possibly can. It is one of the central joys of my retirement, and I've been fortunate to enjoy the good health that makes such activities possible. My parents' deaths were instructive: my dad had a long decline into inactivity and dementia, a gradual withdrawing from life that was painful to watch (especially for my mom) and for him, a lifelong outdoorsman, even more painful to experience. When he died at 89, we all felt a sense of relief that he was finally freed from his suffering. My mom, in contrast, lived for 7 very active years after his passing, was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer just shy of her 90th birthday, refused all but palliative treatment, and died 5 months later. Those were difficult months, to be sure, but she fulfilled her wish to die in her own home (she didn't spend a single day in the hospital) with her children nearby. I have thought often about her final weeks, which were, frankly, grueling. Had assisted suicide been available to her, I believe she would have chosen that path. Such a decision becomes much more complicated, of course, if one is suffering from Alzheimer's disease or another form of dementia. Would I choose it? It's hard to say, and would depend, of course, on my age and condition, and the wishes of my family. But I would very much want that option--as I believe most of us would, if we face the question honestly.
Katy, thank you for this thoughtful (and informative) comment. You probably know this; MAID (Medical Aid in Dying) is legal in the state of Maine, since 2020.
Great topic.
So sorry about your parents. 😞
The issue for me is that I don’t think I will be able to afford to live to 100. When we were in WA state property taxes rose with home prices driving seniors out of their homes. There was subsidized housing but they were awful places to live. There was a senior group who showed up at Town Hall meetings asking for improvements. Seniors shouldn’t have to worry about not having heat in the winter.
My parents are 91 and 88 and thank G-d have means and healthy brain function. My dad’s wife is 86 and is still athletic and takes great care of my dad who has physical needs. (He blames it on being a marathon runner in his 40s.)
I’m so relieved my parents never ran into Alzheimer’s and can afford care if needed.
Very important piece, Deb. I appreciate and relate to your honesty. Aging is hard to write about because even though it’s something that begins at birth, we’ve come to associate aging with death. That’s why we don’t like to look at old people or befriend them. The thing is, there is so much variability in aging that it feels like a lottery, I guess because it is! One of my favorite expressions is, “you’ve seen one 80-year old. you’ve seen one 80-year-old! None of us know the condition will be in at 82 (I’m now 81!), 90, 100, or beyond. The best we can do is live until we die.
I just took the Death Clock test & it said I'd live to be 104. I don't believe that, given my various ailments. But it's an interesting app. I'd be surprised to live to 90, though it's a bit depressing to be thinking about it.
Yes it is hard to think about for me too. All anyone can do is to just keep on trucking, in my case playing music with my friends, writing, loving my wife of almost 60 years.
John, I find it very hard to think about (despite the fact that I’m the one sparking the discussion!)
Hmm. The Death Clock told me I would live until 85. I asked for a cause of death, and it said suicide. Which is interesting and not what I expected...😲
Jeffrey, whoa, that’s a bit weird; Sam assures me that the app is really not reliable. Not enough factors considered, etc. etc. I asked ChatGPT (ha ha) how accurate the death clock is. It replied, it’s not, really, but it’s a motivational tool to prompt you to change your diet or exercise or sleep more, or whatever!
No worries, I'm aware this is a long way from being a scientifically accurate method. It doesn't factor in one's genetic inheritance, for example. And anyway, 85 sounds about right for me!
No to 100. No to any days or years where I’m unable to care for myself or function as I desire.
Dee, I agree.
Very interesting Debbie. I'd suggest those living in paradise, e.g-Stonington,ME, will have distinct advantages. My wife and I dream of moving to midcoast ME, to be surrounded by stunningly beautiful nature and wonderfully warm, inviting neighbors. I think that helps and may give you and husband the leg up you need. I may end up nearer to Connecticut coast or the Bershires. Still in the planning stage. Overall I also share your concerns, and with whether to eliminate alcohol or not (tough one). Cheers!
Not really. I don’t have a lot of younger friends and family and I don’t want to be the last one left.