The Four-Quarter Life: my (lively) debate with Avivah Wittenberg-Cox on whether it's reality or hype

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The Four-Quarter Life: my (lively) debate with Avivah Wittenberg-Cox on whether it's reality or hype

Avivah argues we can plan for a long, four-quarter life. I argue that "shit happens" and life doesn’t always follow the plan—especially in Q4.

Debbie Weil

and

Avivah Wittenberg-Cox

Nov 01, 2025

Can we really plan for four quarters of life?
Avivah Wittenberg-Cox
thinks so. I think maybe not… at least not yet. We both agree we can approach these final decades with optimism and intention.

I invited

Avivah Wittenberg-Cox

to join me on a LIVE yesterday to discuss longevity, aging, and her “four-quarter life” model.

We explored what Q4 (roughly 75–100) can look like—balancing optimism about longer lives with realism about health, ageism, and uncertainty. This could be the definition of [b]old age!

Avivah is known for her work on gender and generational balance in the workplace, and for her idea that life unfolds in four quarters: we grow, achieve, become, and finally, harvest. I question whether living to 100 is a realistic—and desirable—goal.

Avivah explained that her focus has evolved from gender balance to generational balance, as companies now face five generations in one workforce and an aging consumer base. She believes the smartest organizations are beginning to adapt, and that as people live longer, they’ll need to stay engaged—working, learning, and contributing well into later life.

Avivah’s 4-Quarter Model

Her four-quarter model isn’t literal math, she said—it’s a metaphor for planning across a longer lifespan. The fourth quarter, in her view, is about harvesting: reaping the benefits of what we’ve built in health, work, and relationships, and continuing to give back—perhaps as mentors, caregivers, or simply wise elders.

I pushed back. I told her that while I love the idea of four quarters, I’m not sure the fourth one really exists—not yet. From what I see, most people don’t have 25 active years between 75 and 100. I also raised what I called the “shit happens”1 factor—the randomness of illness, frailty, or cognitive decline that disrupts even the healthiest plans.

Avivah agreed that aging brings challenges, but argued that lifestyle, mindset, and preparation can dramatically change outcomes for future generations.

Healthspan vs. lifespan

We talked about healthspan versus lifespan—the gap between how long we live and how long we live “well.” I define healthspan as our functional years, when we are physically, cognitively, and emotionally healthy. Avivah pointed to data showing that in many countries, including Japan and Italy, healthspans are increasing alongside lifespans. I noted that in the U.S., healthspan is not increasing with lifespan2—and that many of my peers are already showing visible signs of decline in their seventies.

The science of aging

The conversation turned lively around science. Avivah referenced researchers like the controversial David Sinclair, a Harvard geneticist and co-author of Lifespan: Why We Age—And Why We Don’t Have To. Sinclair sees aging as a disease that is treatable and even asserts that aging can be reversed3. I pushed back: aging isn’t a disease, it’s a process (and at least so far, there is no magic pill that can reverse it).

I suggested Peter Attia MD and his book, Outlive: the Science and Art of Longevity, as a resource for how to think realistically about aging, healthspan, and the final decade or two of life. As Attia put it in his recent interview on 60 Minutes: “At 75, both men and women fall off a cliff.” That is, Attia says, unless you train for old age like it’s a sport, concentrating on fitness, strength, and how well you move.

Avivah countered that while we can’t stop aging, we can shift it—and that each generation is already aging differently than the one before.

We both extolled

Laurie Marbas, MD, MBA

and her suggestion of tiny steps to improve healthy aging.

The importance of being, rather than doing

By the end, we found common ground. We both agreed that people in Q3, in their 50s and 60s, should prepare for longer lives—financially, emotionally, physically—and that companies and cultures need to stop writing older adults off. We also agreed that the fourth quarter is not necessarily about productivity but about being: slowing down, mentoring, connecting, and finding meaning.